01/02/1996 - City Council Special • MINUTES OF A SPECIAL JOINT MEETING OF THE
EAGAN CITY COUNCIL AND SOLID WASTE ABATEMENT COMMISSION
Eagan, Minnesota
January 2, 1996
A special joint meeting of the Eagan City Council and the Solid Waste Abatement
Commission was held on Tuesday, January 2, 1996 at 5:00 p.m. Present were Mayor Egan,
Councilmembers Awada, Hunter,Masin,Wachter and Solid Waste Abatement Commission members Terry
Davis, Floyd Hier, Jim Weinzettel, Ken Ische, Wally Wall, Rick Patraw, John Tapper and Dan Breve.
Absent was Al Swenseid Also present were City Administrator Tom Hedges, Assistant to the City
Administrator Hohenstein, Communications/Recycling Coordinator Foote, Ron Moening of BFI, Mike
Berkopec of Waste Management and Bob Elliott of Quality Waste Control.
REFUSE/RECYCLING COLLECTION SYSTEM
City Administrator Hedges stated that a year ago the City Council charged the Solid Waste
Abatement Commission with reviewing the City of Eagan's current waste collection system and to make
a recommendation that would reduce the number of trucks on City streets. He continued that the purpose
of this meeting was to review the commission's recommendation.
Chair Davis of the Solid Waste Abatement Commission (SWAC) stated that the SWAC
meetings to discuss the waste collection system have been very valuable. He also commented that the
participation of the haulers who have attended meetings has been very beneficial and informative to the
commission. Chair Davis said that the commission members are here to answer any questions the Council
may have regarding the commission's recommendation.
Coordinator Foote commented that as a result of the Pope Reid study done in 1989, the
current districting system was put in place. There are nine licensed residential haulers,some are very small
companies. She stated that six haulers currently are involved in the majority of the residential hauling in
Eagan.
Administrator Hedges and Mayor Egan reminded the members that workshop sessions are
fairly informal and encouraged comments from those present.
Councilmember Hunter stated that he thought the packet was done very well and thanked
Chair Davis for pulling the whole thing together. He asked how many neighborhoods were actually
organized currently. Coordinator Foote replied that they did not keep track of the number. She stated that
if people call her and ask about neighborhood organization she lets them know that they can do so. The
problem with the system is that with the transitory nature of many residents,it's difficult to find people willing
to organize the neighborhoods and keep on top of changes that may occur within the neighborhood. Chair
Davis stated that neighborhood organization seems to work well with homeowners associations.
Mayor Egan asked whether having less than 100 homes organized is economically viable
for homeowners and the haulers. Is it possible to save money with this type of system? Chair Davis stated
that he was not sure and that this was something that needed to be worked out with haulers. Commission
member Weinzettel stated that his company has dealt with small associations of 15 homes or so. He said
that it can be viable but it does depend on the number of residents participating.
•
EAGAN SPECIAL CITY COUNCIL MINUTES/JANUARY 2, 1996
• PAGE 2
Coordinator Foote stated that it also depends on what the neighborhood is looking for.Such
as, if they are concerned about the traffic level rather than the cost. Consequently, there are impacts
beyond price considerations.
Councilmember Awada stated that it seemed that this system would be advantageous to
the haulers. Commission member Wall stated that his company has been proactive with neighborhood
groups. He said that larger groups are better in that they are much more productive.
Councilmember Awada stated that the Council was concerned about road wear and are
interested in reducing the number of trucks.
Mayor Egan stated that with the number of trucks travelling Eagan streets,noise and safety
are also issues along with the street wear and tear. He stated one of the minuses is that if neighborhood
groups are responsible for organizing and no one is getting paid for administrating it and there are no
incentives, they may just get tired of dealing with it after awhile. Another question is how to maintain
uniformity. Chair Davis replied that uniformity would be maintained by the use of statutes and ordinances.
Assistant to the City Administrator Hohenstein stated that the ordinance has a provision which ensures that
homeowners in a homeowners association are given the opportunity to recycle.
Councilmember Wachter asked how they would make new Eagan residents aware of
neighborhood organization. Should they call City Hall? Neighbors? Coordinator Foote stated that new
residents do contact the City. They are given a packet of information which includes the list of licensed
haulers within the City. If they ask about haulers City staff recommends that they check with their neighbors
• and contact several haulers.
Councilmember Wachter stated that if he were a hauler, he would like to work with
neighborhood organizations. He continued that if neighbors worked together, it would be advantageous to
neighborhoods and to the haulers.
Councilmember Masin stated that a number of people have asked for fewer trucks. She
stated that the smaller neighborhoods would have a more difficult time organizing than the larger ones. She
continued that often neighbors don't see each other much or are very busy. Mayor Egan stated that this
is his concern also. In areas such as the Cedar Grove area, it may be better not to set boundaries.
Commission member Breve stated that when they talk about neighborhood organization
it doesn't have to be formal. It may just be a case of neighbors talking to each other.
Councilmember Hunter asked if the commission had discussed ways to educate the public
in neighborhood organization. Chair Davis stated that they haven't discussed it but that it should be a joint
effort. Councilmember Hunter stated that most people don't realize this is an option.
Coordinator Foote stated that there is concern by haulers that if the City did this proactively
that they would recommend certain haulers. The City staff cannot do this, consequently, the involvement
by the City should be limited and it should involve participation by the haulers. By providing a packet of
information, the residents could be told how to go about organizing their neighborhoods. Councilmember
Awada stated that she believes people will be willing to do this. People need to be able to participate, to
be involved.
• Coordinator Foote commented that this may result in uniting neighborhoods and perhaps
encourage them to find other ways to cooperate, for instance, crime watches, etc. Commission member
anon3
EAGAN SPECIAL CITY COUNCIL MINUTES/JANUARY 2, 1996
• PAGE 3
Weinzettel stated that in that regard he is aware of a group of 60 homeowners who all use one dry cleaning
service, as well as the same lawn care and snow removal services. Mayor Egan asked how exhaustive
something like this would be. Commission member Weinzettel stated that he wasn't aware of that but that
it seems to work for this group of homes.
Commission member Breva stated that there are certain parts of the City that regardless
of what's done, there will be quite a few trucks. He said that the level of citizen concern needs to be
addressed.
Mayor Egan stated that there are older parts of Eagan interconnected and areas that are
more isolated. If the City gets involved in managing this system,to what degree would the City have to be
involved in waste processing with the County?Coordinator Foote stated that with most of the systems we
have included a disclaimer on the matrix. We realized that during the process there are other issues such
as how to make sure there are standardized fees,that billing issues be considered as well as management
of the system, consequently, it would mean much more involvement by the City. Commission member
Breva stated there is a line but it's not really clear at what point it's crossed and the City becomes the
owner of the solid waste.
Councilmember Masin asked Commission member Wall to explain the meaning of a
statement she received in her bill from Knutson Services that stated residents are responsible for the
landfill distribution. Commission member Wall stated that this is generally what is being talked about and
this is a way of making residents aware of these requirements.
• Commission member Weinzettel stated that it's thought that if we can get 100 homes for
one hauler, that this would be a savings. Actually, this is not always the case. The city of Farmington
which has a municipal system has rates higher than the industry average.There is a community on the east
side of the County that has had one hauler for years but their rates are competitive with no substantial
savings. Councilmember Awada stated that these are monopolies. If there is competition,there should be
lower rates. She continued that if she was a hauler, she would be actively promoting neighborhood
organization. Commission member Weinzettel stated that the haulers do look for this type of situation but
it is very difficult to find those people who will do the organizing. Councilmember Awada suggested sending
a separate flyer out concerning neighborhood organization. This could inform residents about the reasons
for organizing such as improved safety, fewer trucks, etc.
Mayor Egan stated it's one thing for haulers to have it perpetrated on them. It's another for
haulers to conspire amongst themselves to regulate competition. Haulers can't regulate competition as this
could be construed as antitrust and this is illegal. Coordinator Foote stated that this has been a
consideration. This is an area that the commission needs to research.
Councilmember Masin stated that cost was not the original rationale for this, it was the
traffic situation. She said that she would not change haulers to save money because she's happy with
them. Other's may feel differently but in order for there to be agreement, it is necessary to set criteria to
give the residents a reason to make the change. Mayor Egan referred to a list of positives on page 7 of
the packet regarding neighborhood organization. This should be conveyed to the residents.
Councilmember Wachter stated that the reason for a different system is to reduce the
number of trucks. He said if they pointed out the advantages and disadvantages for neighborhood
organization and if people are given the information they need, they can work in their neighborhoods and
• the City doesn't need to get involved. Councilmember Awada agreed with Councilmember Wachter. She
()0004
EAGAN SPECIAL CITY COUNCIL MINUTES/JANUARY 2, 1996
• PAGE4
stated that if they could get 25% of the neighborhoods organized it would be very successful. The City
shouldn't be recommending the organizing, they should be educating people on it.
Councilmember Masin stated that people just don't have the time to do this kind of thing.
Councilmember Wachter stated that if they had the information they might. Councilmember Hunter stated
that educating is the important thing. People may just not be aware that neighborhood organization is an
option.
At 5:45 p.m. Patrick Frater joined the meeting.
Chair Davis asked for input from Councilmembers on the issue of a cap placed on the
number of licenses issued. Councilmember Wachter agreed with limiting the number. Chair Davis stated
that they may set a cap lower than it is currently and allow attrition to take its course. Councilmember
Awada stated that she would not want to do anything to hurt competition. Chair Davis stated that each
additional hauler adds two to three trucks. He continued that a cap should be set and they need a
minimum number and a maximum number. Commission member Hiar stated that he did research the
haulers and discovered that approximately 80% of the homes in Eagan are served by six haulers. He
continued that this showed that there was a perception of a lot of trucks because there were smaller haulers
in smaller pockets. The small haulers are the ones that eventually leave the industry.
Mayor Egan asked Commission member Hiar if he was recommending a cap that exceeds
or matches the current number. Commission member Hiar responded that he would like to see a match
of the current number. Councilmember Wachter asked the other members how they felt about it. Chair
• Davis stated that attrition would be used to narrow the number down.
At 5:55 p.m. Ken Ische joined the group.
Mayor Egan said that they need to clarify what would constitute a reduction of haulers.
Commission member Frater stated that it would involve the absorbing of a small company by a larger one.
He stated that most of the major players are in Eagan. Councilmember Masin asked what criteria would
be used for adding a new hauler to this system. Councilmember Hunter stated this system would not allow
it. Commission member Hiar said that it had to do with a rate survey and the level of competition.
Councilmember Hunter stated that if through collusion or otherwise rates go up 50%they may want to look
at it. Assistant to the City Administrator Hohenstein stated that there would be a natural inertia and that
it would take quite a while before getting to that point. Commission member Frater stated that the ultimate
threat to haulers is a municipally run system and, consequently, they should work hard to service their
market.
Councilmember Wachter stated that he would like to thank the commission for the work
they have done. He said that he is in favor of the first three recommendations listed in the memo. He
continued that it is important to give people the freedom of knowing what is available and what their
responsibilities are. Mayor Egan asked if the SWAC should continue to explore the other options.
Councilmember Wachter replied yes,he would like to know what they are. Chair Davis stated that he would
like to research them more thoroughly. Some of them may not be considered while others may be
workable.
Councilmember Hunter asked the commission if there is a trend to stop separating
recyclables from solid waste and, if that's the case, is it because of improved technology. Commission
member Patraw said that the state won't allow it so it's not going to happen.
•
i)O*1 "5
EAGAN SPECIAL CITY COUNCIL MINUTES/JANUARY 2, 1996
• PAGES
Councilmember Hunter asked if there was enough time for an ordinance change before the
moratorium has expired. City Administrator Hedges stated that it would be tight but it would be possible
to extend the moratorium. Assistant to the City Administrator Hohenstein stated that the cap on hauler
licenses would require an ordinance. Staff could attempt to have this prepared for the January 16, 1996
City Council meeting and, if it is not ready, the moratorium could be extended for one month. City
Administrator Hedges stated that any direction should involve a change of the ordinance by the City
Attorney's office.
Mayor Egan stated that he assumed they would be putting together packets of information
for citizens. He asked what type of information they would include in the packets. Coordinator Foote stated
that staff would work closely with the haulers. They would provide information on how neighborhoods could
organize. Perhaps a seminar for residents could be held and at that meeting, a list of names of people in
these neighborhoods who can be contacted by haulers. Commission member Weinzettel said that the
SWAC needs to assist with preparation of the packets. Councilmember Hunter said that there is so much
information it needs to be a separate mailing of information. Coordinator Foote stated that along with
information from the City, it would be possible to have haulers send out stuffers with their billings.
Mayor Egan commended SWAC for the work that they went to in preparing the
recommendation. He stated he was impressed with the thoroughness with which the commission examined
the systems. He asked what type of information the hauling community provided the commission.
Coordinator Foote stated that when the commission started getting into specifics the haulers provided
examples from their own experiences and could tell the commission that what works in theory may or may
not work in reality.Assistant to the City Administrator Hohenstein stated that the value of the group is that
• it's interdisciplinary. There are a certain number of citizens and haulers on the commission. The
commission took an extra step in listening to the haulers views and he was pleased with their participation.
Mayor Egan asked if there was enough consensus to discuss this item at the next City
Council meeting. Coordinator Foote suggested that they decide on items to be recommended for further
study.
Commission member Ische commented that he was in the minority in that he believes they
could get it down to one hauler per neighborhood with organized hauling. He believes it is a good idea but
is not sure how the residents will accept it. He stated that a cap on licenses will reduce trucks but not as
much as a single hauler would.
Commission member Patraw stated that it would be important to have some sort of
benchmark or measurement as to how well the system is working, otherwise,there's no way to measure
its success. Councilmember Awada suggested that they do a test using just a part of Eagan.
Councilmember Hunter stated that the main effort involved will be the preparation of packets. The City
does not need to get involved with actual organizing. If citizens have questions, they should contact the
haulers.
Coordinator Foote stated that they can start out by putting out a packet and see what type
of response is received. Assistant to the City Administrator Hohenstein stated that curb side recycling
started out as an experiment and maybe this would be the same type of thing. Commission member Hiar
stated that a phased approach may be the best. He said that if they did the whole City, the haulers would
not be able to respond to the requests. He continued that they could set it up in three sections with a
month delay between each section. Councilmember Awada said that they should take a more activist
• approach at first. Perhaps initially the City could give out names of neighborhood organizers and keep track
of what's happening.
nenn
EAGAN SPECIAL CITY COUNCIL MINUTES/JANUARY 2, 1996
• PAGE 6
Mayor Egan thanked the commission for all their work.
City Administrator Hedges distributed a month at a glance calendar to each Councilmember.
He informed them that he would like to eventually develop a two month at a glance calendar and a year
at a glance calendar. This would help keep track of the open issues and when they would be coming up
for Council consideration. City Administrator Hedges reviewed upcoming meetings.
The meeting adjourned at 6:25 p.m.
JEH
41116.1 _ / January 2, 1996
Chair Date
. _