01/05/1984 - Advisory Parks & Recreation Commission
MINUTES OF A REGULAR MEETING OF THE ADVISORY PARKS AND RECREATION COMMISSION
EAGAN, MINNESOTA
JANUARY 5, 1984
A regular meeting of the Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission was called
to order by Chairman Martin at 7:00 P.M.. Members present were Martin, Bertz,
Thurston, McNeely, Alt, Kubik, Fedde, Jackson, Masin and Carroll. Also pre-
sent were the Director of Parks and Recreation, Ken Vraa, and Administrative
Staff Person, Liz Witt. Larry Frank, Dave Gabbert and Jim Curry were also
present to discuss proposed developments.
AGENDA
Park and Recreation Director Vraa, requested the addition of the Westbury
proposed plat to development proposals. Commission member Jackson moved
and Masin seconded to approve the agenda as amended. The motion carried.
MINUTES
Commission member Carroll moved, Thurston seconded, to approve the December 1,
1983 minutes as presented. The motion passed.
DEVELOPMENT PROPOSALS
A) Berkshire Pond
Larry Frank of Derrick Land Company was again present to discuss the Berkshire
Pond development. Derrick Land Company proposes 73 lots on 27 acres. The pro-
posed park parcel is somewhat over four acres of which 2.5 acres is land and
the remainder is in two ponds. Mr. Frank indicated he is having a difficult
time selling the homeowners association concept. The potential developer said
he was definitely not interested in this concept. Mr. Frank said nothing else
had changed in the development from the December Commission review and he would
like to dedicate the parcel as park to fulfill the dedication requirements.
Chairman Martin noted there is not enough money for small parks which only
serve 73 homes. While it may be nice to have a tot lot for each residential
development, such a park would not b?nefit the City as a whole. The small
size would pose a maintenance and development problem. The proposed park
and residential plat is in the Ridgecliff neighborhood park service area
and is connected by a walkway. He also reiterated he does not like to see
a tot lot so close to water. Chairman Martin stated he preferred the tot lot
be located elsewhere and the developer just redraw his lot lines. He did not
want the City to accept the parcel fcr a park.
Minutes
January 5, 1984
Page Two.
At the request of Mr. Frank, the discussion then revolved around how much
credit might be given the developer if the parcel were included as a pri-
vate park. Director Vraa said there is no precedence to his knowledge for
private parkland to be given park dedication credit. He noted that approxi-
mately 1/3 credit was given for a - smaller than usual parcel in Cinnamon Ridge
but it was not a private park site.
After a brief discussion, Chairman Martin moved to recommend a cash dedica-
tion for Berkshire Pond development. He cited the small size of the parcel;
the proximity and accessibility to Ridgecliff Park; the unacceptability of
proposed use (tot lot) and the fact the parcel would not benefit the City.
Doug McNeely seconded the motion. The Commission approved the recommendation
with Commission member Masin abstaining. As a footnote, the Commission did
encourage the developer to form a homeowners association to guide the park
if he chose to retain the outlot as open space.
B) Westbury Plat & Lexington South PUD
The Director of Parks and Recreation again introduced the Westbury/Lexington
South PUD issue saying the City Council has asked the Commission to again
review the issue of parkland in the Westbury Plat. He went on to explain
that this issue is also interrelated to the whole issue of parkland in the
Lexington South PD. The Director explained that Mr. Curry, owner/developer
of the PUD, is hopeful in dedicating remaining parkland. The Director con-
tinued to explain other aspects of the early dedication.
Director Vraa then stated that the proposed Westbury is a mix of single
family and twin homes. In the original planned development, it was pro-
posed that 8.3 acres would be dedicated as park. It was the thought at
the time of agreement that the park parcel might serve as a connection
trail to Patrick Eagan Park from Westcott Road. The proposed Westbury
Plat has changed this concept and topography would make such a trail ex-
tremely difficult. There is no access from Westcott to the parcel it was
explained. Jim Curry of Lexington South spoke to the park dedication issue.
He said the entire PD covers 1,153 acres and they've agreed to dedicate
approximately 145 + acres or 25 acres + over the 10% required. He stated
further that 67.5 acres have been dedicated and 73.6 acres remain to be
dedicated. Mr. Curry noted that HUD has. changed its rules and he can now
dedicate all the remaining parkland and get out from under the tax burden
that waiting for final plats entails. He too would like to have the West-
bury park dedication resolved as it is part of Lexington South PD.
Chairman Martin commented that in the early days it was undesirable parcels
which were given as park dedication. He said the only purpose for the West-
bury Park parcel was a trail and now that purpose is no longer valid. He
said the parcel would not be an amenity for the City. Chairman Martin pre-
ferred to negotiate for park elsewhere in the PD. Commission member Carroll
said a passive park is not needed, but that a ball type park is. He further
noted that the Parks Commission has a responsibility to the community resi-
dents and the parcel in question is really not usable for active activities.
Its value is in open space only.
Minutes
January 5, 1984
Page Three.
Jim Curry noted there may be some othersmall areas the City could trade for,
but most of the area is spoken for.
Parks and Recreation Director Vraa said there is also the question of amount
of credit given for the high line trail and ponding-credits which should be
calculated and applied against the dedications.
Jim Curry and Dave Gabbert-stated they want to continue with development
this spring, stating they've been held up for months on the project with
easement problems. He felt the City was anxious to move on the project
and hoped for a decision by the January 17 City Council Meeting.
Commission member Thurston agreed that the Commission must address the
park dedication for Westbury as well as with the amount of credit to be
given for the parcel. She noted the eight acres under discussion did
not include the sliver of land owned by Mr. McCarthy which was between
Westcott Road and the proposed park. Commission member Carroll thought
the City should look for its ten-acre park on the McCarthy property; but
he said the City cannot give credit for this parcel and then not accept
it. There was considerable discussion regarding the parcel, credits for
ponds, language in the PD and alternatives available.
After discussion Chairman Martin stated that it appears the Commission's
preference is not to take the parcel for park, but to negotiate elsewhere
for a park site. He asked the department staff to study the park dedica-
tion given in the Lexington South PD to see if appropriate credit was given
and if total acreage is correct. If the figures are short, he added, the
City should be given additional acreage elsewhere. Mr. Curry suggested
that the park could be outloted at this time to allow the development
process to proceed. This, he said, would still allow the Commission time
to decide if it wants the park. Parks Director Vraa said he would like
to review the park dedication in more detail with Mr. Curry to see if the
145 acres are adequate. He suggested a special meeting be held before
the next regular City Council Meeting. This would allow time to study
the issue in more detail to assure that the Council knows exactly where
the Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission stands regarding the proposed
park dedication. He stated he did not think Mr. Curry should place the
parcel in an outlat pending the park study.
Commission member Carroll moved and Fedde seconded to table the Westbury
Plat and Lexington South Park dedication to a January 11 meeting. The
motion carried unanimously.
Minutes
January 5, 1984
Page Four.
OLD BUSINESS
A) Park System - Park Finances
Parks and Recreation Director Vraa told the Commission that the City Council
approved the Task Force concept and will establish the group soon. Director
Vraa has reviewed a list of 25 names with City Administrator Hedges and a
final list will be presented to the City Council at its January 17 meeting.
He went on to review the material in the packet saying that the Phase I-
Working Proposal could be equated to a bond issue for $3.2 million and $1
million for Phase II. As for meeting 1990 needs, the City would be somewhat
short of soccer, baseball and softball fields. The number of tennis courts
and hockey rinks would be adequate.
Member Masin questioned the specific action being taken, i.e. the removal
of the hockey facility at Carnelian when it is so heavily used. There was
discussion regarding this with the explanation the rink would not be taken
out until a replacement was ready.
Commission member Kubik reiterated the need to.define the Task Force goal -
that of financing.
There was a consensus that what had been prepared could be presented to the
Task Force for their review.
B) Park Names
The Park Name Committee Chairman, Richard Carroll, presented the following
list of park names to the Commission. The Blue Cross/Blue Shield site was
removed from the list. The high line trail was changed to Logger's Trail
and Walnut Hill Park was the selected name for Wedgwood Park. The remaining
names were accepted as presented (list follows).
CURRENTLY KNOWN AS RECOMMENDED NAME
OAK CHASE OAK CHASE PARK
NORTHVIEW DOWNING ATHLETIC FIELDS
THOMAS LAKE THOMAS LAKE
CARNELIAN CARNELIAN PARK
CAPRICORN GOAT HILL PARK
COACHMAN STONECUTTERS PARK
CHES MAR ROBBER'S RAVINE PARK
CINNAMON RIDGE CINNAMON PARK
COUNTRY HOME HEIGHT COUNTRY HOME PARK
DEBOER O'LEARY PARK
DONNYWOOD BARLEY CORN PARK
FISH LAKE FISH LAKE PARK
HILL TOP BERRY PATCH PARK
PILOT KNOB PILOT KNOB PARK
RIDGE CLIFF RIDGECLIFF PARK
WEDGEWOOD WALNUT HILL PARK
Minutes
January 5, 1984
Page Five.
CURRENTLY KNOWN AS (CONT.) RECOMMENDED NAME (CONT.)
WINDTREE WESCOTT STATION PARK
WOODHAVEN WOODHAVEN PARK
MEADOWLANDS MEADOWLAND PARK
HI LINE LOGGERS TRAIL
SCHWANZ LAKE TRAPP FARM PARK
Commission member Carroll moved and Jackson seconded to accept the slate of
names and recommended Council action for official name designation of parks.
The motion passed unanimously.
NEW BUSINESS
Meadowlands Park
The Director of Parks and Recreation presented a base map of Meadowlands
Park as prepared by Mr. Erkkila. He reminded the Commission that they had
requested a training session on the process and issues a Park Planner goes
through. The purpose of the base map was for the Commission to now try and
"plan" the park. He explained the process to be used and the follow-up
session at the next meeting by Mr. Erkkila.
Chairman Martin asked to continue with the agenda first and return to this
after adjournment. Following adjournment, the Commission met until 11:00 P.M.
to go through the "planning" of Meadowlands. Chairman Martin concluded that
the planning of Meadowlands was a great learning experience and demonstrated
the wide variety of issues which must be addressed throughout the planning
process.
OTHER BUSINESS
A) Kehne House
The Director reported that he had contacted an Eagan resident and architect,
Roger Sjobeck, to look over the house and do an independent evaluation. He
had met with the Chief Building Official and the Director to review the house
plans and problems. He has also visited the house and took several pictures.
Mr. Sjobeck will need a few weeks to develop ideas, make cost estimates, etc.
for the Kehne House.
B) Program Directions
The City offices recently vacated at 3795 Pilot Knob Road are being remodeled.
Parks Director Vraa suggested that the Commission be thinking of uses for the
Community Room with senior citizen programs a definite possibility. This will
be an agenda item at the February and March meetings.
Minutes
January 5, 1984
Page Six.
C) Grant Applications
The final grant application for Fish Lake is almost ready. The Director
stated that funding appears very likely for the spring of '84.
D) Skating Rinks
The skating rinks had to be closed on January 5 and will not be reopened
until the weather turns colder and rinks reflooded.
E) MEED Intern
Director Vraa announced he has a new intern hired under the MEED Program -
Jim Sturm, a U Of Minnesota Landscape Architect. He will be with the Parks
Department for six months.
ADJOURNMENT
On a motion by Alt, seconded by McNeely, the official Commission Meeting
adjourned at 10:10 P.M..
Dated: v J
Advisory Parks and Recreation Secretary