12/04/1986 - Advisory Parks & Recreation Commission
MINUTES OF A REGULAR MEETING OF
THE ADVISORY PARKS AND RECREATION COMMISSION
EAGAN, MINNESOTA
DECEMBER 4, 1986
A regular meeting of the Advisory Parks & Recreation Commission was called to
order by Chairman Martin at 7:00 p.m. Members present were Porter, Alt,
Martin, Thurston, Bertz, Caponi, Carroll, Kubik, and Ketcham. Absent was
Commission member Masin, who was out of town. Staff present were Director of
Parks & Recreation Ken Vraa, Parks Planner/Landscape Architect Steve Sullivan,
Planner Jim Sturm, Student Intern Julie Lencowski, Parks Superintendent John
VonDeLinde, and Recreation Supervisors Dorothy Peterson and Paula Sunder.
Other visitors were present for specific agenda items.
AGENDA
Chairman Martin asked to have added to the agenda Item C-6, Pine Crest
Addition. There were no other additions and the agenda was approved as
amended.
MINUTES OF NOVEMBER 6, 1986
Motion by Carroll, seconded by Kubik, all members in favor, the minutes of
November 6, 1986 were approved.
1. DEVELOPMENT PROPOSALS - PINE CREST ADDITION
Chairman Martin indicated that the development proposals would be taken out of
order because Mr. Sturm was being delayed as a result of another meeting.
Parks Planner/Landscape Architect Steve Sullivan presented the Pine Crest
Addition as a preliminary plat for seventeen single-family homes in Parks
Service Section #15. Mr. Sullivan explained the impact of the high water
elevation on the park property and the need for a trail through this proposed
plat in order to gain access to a portion of the park impacted by high water
elevation. There were questions by the Commission regarding the water
elevation and they were responded to by Mr. Sullivan. Chairman Martin
indicated that it was important to get this trail through in order to
accomplish the parks plan. Member Thurston questioned what the .7 of an acre
parks land dedication would look like if taken. The Director of Parks and
Recreation responded that a land dedication would preclude the developer from
platting the entire seventeen lots in the addition. The loss of a single-
family lot may jepordize this development. Therefore, Staff was recommending
that there be a cash dedication along with a trail easement and the
requirement for the developer to bench in the trail. This would still
accomplish the City park objectives. In response to a question, Steve
Sullivan responded that the developer was aware of this and was agreeable.
After further discussion, a motion by Kubik, seconded by Thurston, with all
members voting in favor, the Advisory Parks & Recreation Commission
recommended the cash dedication, a scenic and trail easement requiring the
developer to bench in a trailway to the park peninsula, and assurances that
there be no disturbance to the vegetation by the eventual lot owner.
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2. LONE OAK SECOND ADDITION NORTHWEST AEROSPACE TRAINING
Staff reviewed the proposal by Northwest Airlines for its aerospace training
facility. There were numerous questions regarding the size of the parcel and
the need for ponding area.' After additional discussion, there was a
recommendation by the Advisory Commission on a motion by Bertz, seconded by
Kubik, that this plat be responsible for the cash dedication requirement.
3. DIFFLZY CENTER
Planner Jim Sturm was present for -an explanation of the proposed Diffley
Center addition. - Planner Sturm stated that the proposal includes the
development-of a Target store and a Northwest Racquet & Swim Club. He
explained the circulation pattern, the roadway, and suggested other uses
•'1ai-thin -the proposed development. As it related to parks, it was noted that
the developer was proposing to provide approximately 8-1/2 acres of park land.
In addition, the developer would pay a cash dedication requirement consistent
with the City's policy regarding commercial industrial property. In response
to=a -question, it was'noted that the City would be-given two years to
determine whether or not it would wish to accept the-gift of the park land.
Commission member Thurston commented on the amount of ponding area in the
proposed public parcel. The Director of Parks & Recreation stated that
the issue for the.Cify is the-rezoning of the property which currently
carries a Comp. Guide designation of R-2. The Parks Commission should confine
itself strictly to the issue of parks, not to the issue of rezoning and use of
thq.property, It was noted that there is an issue of trailways that should be
reviewed by the Commission. The Parks Commission noted that the Planning
-Commission deferred this item until its January meeting, awaiting additional
'information. The Advisory Parks & Recreation Commission then agreed to place
this on its February Commission meeting for further reviewal.
EAGAN JOINT-VENTURE - INFORMAL REVIEW r.•
Parks & Recreation Director Vraa-stated that he had placed the Eagan Joint
Venture Proposal on the Commission agenda as an informal review. He stated
that several members had seen the first proposal which had been modified by
the developer and then presented to a second group of members who saw it at a
second meeting. Furthermore, two members had not yet seen the development
proposal at all. It was intended that the Advisory Commission could provide
Staff with some direction concerning the proposed parks land dedication, which
could then be discussed with the owners and developers of the PUD. Mr. Rod
Hardy, spokesperson for the development, was present and explained who the
property owners were and their thoughts on the development of the PUD. He
then introduced John Uban, Landscape Architect for the project, who then
explained to :the Advisory Commission the objectives of the PUD. He stated
that developers were as concerned about parks as the Advisory Commission and
had used a lineal green belt-system similar to that which was used by the
Minneapolis Park System at its Chain of Lakes. -He stated that the lineal
parkway system provided a tremendous amount of park edge by which homes could
be :ad=jacent to this green space, enhancing both the residential
characteristics as well as the park property. He also stated that this would
,,be a visual amenity as well as providing continuous green belt connection
between neighborhoods in the development. He explained how the trailways
would connect Dodd Road with the existing Northview Park Road as well as
Wescott. Mr. Uban explained the road system, indicating that other roadways
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would contain a median continuing the parkway effect through the residential
development. "He-stated-that there are sufficient, ball fields in the area and
he did ifo`t want to have 'a -park -Tystem that encouraged people from outside
areas to,.play softball within the neighborhood itself. He-said it was a
careful design decision onhow toIhave the best of both worlds which addresses
the natural, the passive, and they idea of preserving the amenities of the land
by linking it with a corridor system that is_ good. for wildlife, for ponding,
and-preservation and, at the same ime,:creating the maximum amount of edge to
the park system which is important'- to the developer as'a marketing tool. He
explained that this would help separate neighborhoods and allow for different
styles of housing while, at the same time, provide for the sharing of
ammenities that adds..val.ue to, everyone. He concluded by saying he felt this
added to-the bu,i;lding of 'quality ieighborhoods'and needed to be worked- into
the. City's park system. He asked the Commission for suggestions on changes
which they could then illustrate or incorporate into. the parks -plan.
He suggested that 'he would like to focus on the • plan for the public park
system and that` the dedication system 'is a `separate issue . They understand
that riot all 6f-'..this would be 100% .dedication .through- different formulas for
%ccepting land as. A dedication.
Mr. Caponi asked for clarification of the "edge system" and the width and the
attributes within the green belt areas shown on the plan. Mr. Uban reviewed
some_of-.these concepts again. Mr. Caponi stated that it was hard to determine
whether or not this was workable, based on the topographic data. Mr. Uban
then explained that there will be-preliminary, plats which will address the
specifics of where every house will go and that will, refine the entire
concept. There will have to be some adjustments as each plat is prepared.
Mr. Caponi said his point was that it should not be just a beautiful view from
the homes but a beautiful view from the park as well. The topography and
vegetation need to h6 -considered.
Chairman Martin explained some misgivings about the original -idea of having
the Commission review the proposal before it was actually submitted. He
stated..his first thought was that it was a pretty good idea to provide this
green space. But, when he saw the map with the topography, he was
disappointed because it appeared that all City Park Department was getting was
the same as parkland that was accepted back in the early 60's which consisted
of ponds and unuseable space. -Mr. Martin continued saying that while it
appears to be 50-50 between active and passive, seeing what he sees now, he is
not very happy with the proposed parks plan The Parks Committee is going to
have to take a real close look because it is such a large PUD. In response to
a question from Mr. Hardy-, Mr. Martin explained that, in the initial
presentation without topography, he did not understand'what was in the mind of
the developer as it related to parks. He stated that the Commission is
looking for a level space to provide for the neighborhood amenities and more
active play space.` Mr. Martin explained that, for example, there was only one
ball field shown, which would not meet the neighborhood standards for the
population derived. After'a discussion and review concerning the City's
standards, Mr. Uban stated that he felt the proposal, as presented now, would
provide for approximately thirty acres of active space which should meet the
City's standards and, in addition, exhibits thirty acres of passive park which
exceeds the City's dedication requirements of forty or so acres. Chairman
Martin explained that it certainly did not appear that there were thirty acres
of level space. Mr. Uban then explained that they were providing thirty acres
of property of less than 12% slopes and within the trail system. Mr. Hardy
said that this entire "issue of parks was very critical to the developer
because he felt that they had thirty acres which met the criteria of the City.
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If they, could develop twelveto,_fifteen acres per thousand population, by
which ten acresr would be level. space-and two acres would be wooded or inactive
space, then they have met the. City's requirement. -'There are thirty acres of
land in, the plan that meets the criteria of open space and play area. He went
on to state that-the developer will not, specify where the space should be and
that ,"it is the Commission's decision as to how it will be graded to meet
your needs but we think that what-we have presented meets your criteria for
the number of peon e. If it doesn't .meet the,, City's. needs, _ we. need hard facts
telling us-exac_tlr-where you need it, where you want it, rand why you want it".
Mr. Hardy then went on to explain, that. he was -trying to.develop a community
here and-that they will provide.-.for the flat, level space needed for the
activities. "We'll. meet-the needs of- that community. The question is, 'do you
want to have time responsibility- for the rest of the space -or do you want this
community to separate.-itself andcbe responsible for its own internal space and
circulation system." : L
Member Kubik stated.that he had-'seen a good presentation-and would like to see
some more -information to digest in,terms.of topography and 'vegetation. He
wanted-more detail and. wanted Staff to` work•.with the developer t(Y get this
information for review at the next meeting. Chairman Martin then said he felt
it would be appropriate for the Development Committee of the Commission to
meet with Staff to get some real'in-depth review.' Several members expressed
agreement with this, Member Thurston explaining that the lineal configuration
of the park land did not lend itself to the type of development needed for
active play space.' There were addi-ti-onal comments by Commission members
regarding the topography, proposed alignment of the park, relationships with
the school distr=ict, road circulation, and adjacent park areas and
development.
The Commission then agreed that no action would be taken .at this time, that
Staff should meet with the developer and then with the Development Committee
to review the proposal.
CITY-CODE.
Chairman Martin stated that what he saw from the materials in the packet was
basically •what he had hoped for, and the.issues as it-related to parks -in. the
Code section. He then asked the Commission members to review the sections
that they had prepared, <highlighting significafit issues or contents. -
Commission members then discussed their sections. In response to a question
in Chapter 3, it was noted that the parks dedication is handled separately
from other City charges but is also done annually. In Chapter 8, the
Commission questioned the regulation of grass, weeds and trees, that it did
not provide for exclusion for parks property as designated by the Director of
Parks and Recreation. Members were concerned that regulations apply to the
City park but prohibit the maintenance of parks in their natural and
unmaintained status.
In-=Section 10.22,. regarding new subdivisions, the word "adequate" was seen as
ambiguous and unclear. Commission members expressed a concern for doing more
in review of this. section, perhaps the necessity of rewriting or redefining.
The Commission also discussed the need to have the Parks Dedication Policy
codified rather than maintained as a policy- because existing Code does not
specifically mention parks dedication regulations. Staff was directed to
write a memorandum to the City Attorney's office regarding this issue.
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Also discussed 'by the Commission were rules and*regulations concerning erosion
control measure-s, tree preservation and reforestation, enforcement issues
dealing-with development, and the need to review alcoholHe beverages in parks.
Mr.--Caponi"explained that from his perspective, which was more European, that
the existing policy 'may -be too-restrictive relative-to the-family and social
gatherings. After discussion, Mr. Martin indicated that heefelt the Advisory
Commission should keep these pages close to them for easy reference.
-STORM SEWER-PLANNING
Director of Parks and Recreation_Vraa explained-that Tom Colbert, Director of
. Public Works, found it -necessary -to leave the Commission-meeting because of
the. time frame and commitment to babysitting responsibilities. He stated that
--he-would be---happy to-,come..back to, the Commission meeting-later on in the
evening. -
(Later in.the-Commission meeting, it was determined that due to-the lateness
of the hour-, - -Mr. Colbert would be, asked back to ,a January.- or-,February- meeting
ato-review the storm sewer planning issues:.
PARK NAMING COMMITTEE
.Member Carrol3 stated thatlhe-had done-some research and pulled together-some
historical data regarding the community and the parks 'requiring naming. He
stated that he was prepared, to cal 1. thee- Park Naming Committee together. The
Commission decided to meet -on Thursday, December 18. It was' also suggested
-that the Development Review Committee would also meet at' that time, if
necessary.
NEW BUSINESS -
Director of Parks and Recreation Vraa distributed reduction of the proposed
trails plan, indicating the modifications made at the last Commission meeting.
Members briefly familiarized themselves with the changes made. It was
suggested that this item be placed on the January meeting for formal approval
and inclusion into the parks systems plan.
DEMOGRAPHIC PROFILE
Julie Lencowski, Intern in the department from the University of Minnesota,
;c;distributed the demographic profile and computations she had been working on.
She stated that the draft document was similar to the Parks Systems Plan
:pages,, and that it was her intent to provide the Commission with the draft
document which could then be incorporated into the systems plan document.
=Ms. -Lencowski then indicated the process in which she collected the
demographic information, including a review of the 1985 Special Census Data
and-all housing units and building permits from September 1985 through 1986.
There was some discrepency in population figures as a result of using housing
'data, vacancies, and the time lag of pulling a building permit to final
.construction and occupancy..--The population indicates that Districts 2 and 5
contain the largest population concentrations for 1985, which is a change from
- the .1982 demographics. . District 5 is still expected to increase by
approximately 114%. She went on to say that the median age of Eagan residents
is now 27.7 years which is an increase of two years over 1982. In comparing
1982 data to 1985, note that the greatest increase in numbers occur in the 25
to 44-year-old age range. Ms. Lencowski than went on to explain other
differentials and impacts on parks service districts and neighborhood parks
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service ar-eas.
Several questions were.-asked by:Commission_members regarding the data,
popula-tian projections, and the Metropolitan Council's figures for growth.
Ms. Lencowski noted' that several parks service districts' actual population-in
1985 exceeded pro"jected.population for 1990, as done in 1982. Members.
expressed appreciation for the work-oJulie had done in completion of the
demographic profile and accepted the draft document.
PARKS SYSTEM PLAN UPDATING
Director of Parks and Recreation Vraa explained. that -the Commission had
annual-ly updated--the parks system's plait during the months of December,
January, and February of ' each year." Noting that Ms. Lencowski had recently
completed the demographic update and that Staff would complete the update on
the Inventory and Analysis section, two sections of this system's plan had
essentially been completed. Further, the City had already embarked upon its
water quality management - study; which "could then be incorporated= 'as:part of
the Ponds and Lakes'-section. The Trail section, reviewed previously, would
also be reviewed in January, and if accepted by the Advisory Commission,
would then become a part of the Trails section. The Director questioned
whether the Advisory Commission felt that it was necessary to review any of
the other sections for updating. Members agreed that such a reviewal did not
seem necessary, and asked staff to update those sections mentioned and a cover
sheet.
WINTER PROGRAM ACTIVITIES
Dorothy Peterson and Paula Sunder were present to review for the Advisory
Commission, planned activities for the upcoming months. Paula Sunder reported
on a new program called, "North Pole Calling". Volunteers would call children
whose parents had responded to a flyer, returning it to the department. The
purpose of the call would be to imitate Santa Claus to these children. Paula
explained their other-activities, including speed skating and the winter
vacation weekend. -Dorothy Peterson told the Commission that interviewing for
warming house attendants is nearly completed and there is a good group of
candidates to select from. She explained other activities, including
volleyball, basketball, and winter weekend. The Commission inquired as to
activities planned for the winter weekend, complimenting both Dorothy and
Paula on the program offerings.
PARKS AND RECREATION VIDEO PRESENTATION =
Director of Parks and Recreation Vraa, noting the hour and the need fora
break, suggested that the Commission take their break while previewing
recently completed video prepared for Group W. This was a first attempt and
the Staff was able to learn,, from developing it. Future shows would be
improved -and modified- based on the experience gained from this first
experimental taping. =
PARKS DEVELOPMENT
Landscape Architect/Parks Planner Steve Sullivan updated the Commission on
park development ativities. Noting that the early snows had interrupted the
progress-on some parks contracts, he stated that the rest of this work would
have to continue over into 1987. Some work "is continuing, however, on the
fencing and 'lighting contract with only restoration work necessary for next
year.
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OTHER BUSINESS AND REPORTS
Director of Parks and Recreation Vraa stated that he has arranged for a tour
on January 10 of community centers in the cities of Eden Prairie, St. Louis
Park, and Brooklyn Center. He left it up to the Advisory Commission to
confirm the starting time. The Commission members agreed to assemble at 9:00
a.m. at the Eagan City Hall on January 10 for the tour.
WINTER MAINTENANCE REPORT
Superintendent of Parks John VonDeLinde reviewed the memorandum concerning
winter maintenance. Included in the priorities were rinks and parking lots.
It was also mentioned that they have to pay additional attention to
maintenance of the ice skating rinks on Saturdays, which are typically heavier
use days than during the week.
OTHER BUSINESS AND REPORTS
There will be a December 9 City Council meeting on the Comprehensive Plan,
members may wish to attend.
Roger Martin, Sandy Masin, and Tom Ketcham were noted as having their terms
expire and would be up for reappointment, if they so desired, for another
three-year term beginning in 1987.
There being no other additional business, the Advisory Commission adjourned at
11:05 p.m.
JWAIARY 30' /987
Date -`Se retary/Treasure
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