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09/01/1988 - Advisory Parks & Recreation Commission MINUTES OF A REGULAR MEETING OF THE ADVISORY PARKS AND RECREATION COMMISSION EAGAN, MINNESOTA SEPTEMBER 1, 1988 A regular, _me.eting of the Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission was called to order at 7:30 P.M. on Thursday, September 1, 1988 with the following Commission Members present: Michele Swanson, Wayne Sames, Sandy Masin, JoAnne Alt, Bob Porter and Dick Carroll. Staff present included Director of Parks and Recreation, Ken Vraa; Landscape Architect/Parks Planner Steve Sullivan; Parks Superintendent, John VonDeLinde; Recreation Supervisor, Dorothy Peterson; Parks Secretary, Cherryl Mesko and Parks Intern, Mel Bailey. Commission Member George Kubik was not present. AGENDA Director Vraa asked that Rahn Trail, identified as Item #8 under New Business, be added,to the agenda. Sandy Masin moved, JoAnne Alt seconded with all members voting in favor to accept the agenda as amended. MINUTES FROM AUGUST 4, 1988 MEETING Page 11, paragraph 6, the term "Purple Stripe" should be replaced with "Purple Loosestrife". Wayne Sames moved, Michele Swanson seconded with all members voting in favor to accept the minutes from August 4, 1988 as amended. MINUTES FROM AUGUST 18, 1988 MEETING Page 3, paragraph 4, last sentence, should be changed to reflect the change from "to" to "too". JoAnne Alt moved, Bob Porter seconded with all members voting in favor to accept the minutes from August 19, 1988 as amended. CONSENT AGENDA The following consent agenda items were presented for approval. On a motion by JoAnne Alt, seconded by Wayne Sames with all members voting in favor, the Commission approved recommendation to the City Council of the following items: 1. T.F. James Co. - That this plat be subject to a cash parkland dedication and that developer be responsible for an 8 foot wide bituminous trail along the north side of County Road 30 and the east side of County Road 31. 2. Opus Corporation - That this proposal be subject to a cash parkland dedication. 3. National Minerals Corporation-NSP - That this proposal be subject to a cash parkland dedication and a 5 foot wide sidewalk be placed on the south side of Lone Oak Road. Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission Minutes of September 1, 1988 Meeting Page 2 WESCOTT SQUARE ADDITION Steve Sullivan reacquainted the Commission members with this issue noting that the Commission at it's August meeting has instructed the developer to provide an open space within the Wescott Square Addition development and show what recreational amenities they were going to include in this area. The Commission also asked to see a layout of the proposed amenities to determine if there was any basis for allowing a parkland dedication credit. In Mr.Sullivan's conversation with the developer, the developer has expressed his interest in providing these amenities at the beginning of the development. Mr. Steve Behnke was present to represent the developer and New Horizon Homes. He noted that they have adjusted 5 buildings on the site to have less impact on the existing trees and vegetation. They feel that in providing the recreational amenities in the development from the beginning this will help with the marketing of the townhomes. The model building is in the southeast portion of the development and the proposed recreational amenities include a 20' x 20' sand pit which will accommodate a plat structure at a later date. Further planned amenities include a second sand pit of comparable size and a gazebo that would be placed in the area with trees which is being planned as an outlot. The sand pits are designed for possible expanded use depending upon the occupants of the townhomes. If the neighborhood becomes primarily adult the pits will allow for the expansion of amenities such as volleyball, horseshoes, etc. Once the homeowners association takes over they can determine their priorities for amenities based on the residents' needs. Member Sames questioned the distance from Wescott Station park. Steve Sullivan responded by stating that Westcott Station was one-half to three- quarters of a mile and that the distance to the Woodlands School park was three-quarters of a mile. Mr. Sames asked what was going into Westcott Station Park. Again, Mr. Sullivan responded by stating that this was a neighborhood park and would have facilities similar to other neighborhood parks but that a master plan had not yet been done for Wescott Station. Steve Sullivan asked Mr. Behnke when the determination would be made as to the placement of these amenities. Mr. Behnke responded by stating that the first sand pit area would be planned and provided during the grading of Phase I. During Phase I I the gazebo, second sand pit and play structure would be added. The plan is to have the amenities put in by the developer concurrent with the development. Mr. Behnke noted that the size of the outlot in this development was approximately 4000 square feet. By adding the initial recreation amenities at the beginning of the development and allowing for some flexibility in developing the future amenities the developer feels this will best meet the needs of the future homeowners since it is unclear at this time if that will include families with children or primarily adults. Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission Minutes of September 1, 1988 Meeting Page 3 As clarification, Dick Carroll noted that it was standard procedure for the Commission to ask that play structures and recreational facilities be provided in a multi-family development of this size and could not see why a credit should be given in this case. Mr. Behnke noted that they were not looking for a parkland "dedication credit, rather the developer wanted to included the amenities up front instead of escrowing funds to do it at a later date. After further discussion, JoAnne Alt moved that the Commission recommend acceptance of the plat as shown including two sand areas, one playground structure and a gazebo. The motion further stated that the developer was to be responsible for a cash parkland dedication and the installation of a 5 foot wide sidewalk on the south side of Yankee Doodle Road. The motion was seconded by Sandy Masin with all members voting in favor. OAK MEADOWS Director Vraa explained that the information in the packet relative to Oak.--Meadows located north-of Ktngswoodd! 2nd-Addition--was- -informational only: The parkland dedication requirements have already been met thus no action is required. BRIDLE RIDGE PARK NEIGHBORHOOD REPRESENTATIVES Parks Planner Steve Sullivan briefed the Commission on the background of the neighborhood interest in the development of Bridle Ridge Park. Steve stated that he met with the neighbors on August 9, 1988 and discussed the results of a neighborhood survey that Robin Fluin and Dale Ford spearheaded in determining the needs of the neighborhood for their park. Mr Sullivan explained to the residents that the plans were to grade the parking lot and establish the trails this year. . The residents' concern was the need for playground equipment, the possibility of incorporating an_ open skating area for this winter and the discussion of a wading pool. Dale Ford representing the neighborhood addressed the Commission by explaining that the neighborhood had formed -an-Ad Hoc park committee that included Stone Bridge, Stone Bridge Hills, Stone Bridge Meadows area and the Eagan Hills Farm area. Mr. Ford noted that based on the survey only they showed 44 children in the 0-4 age range indicating the need for facilities to accommodate this age group; Their , survey- also noted 0,e neighborhood's interest in tennis courts and a wading pool. Based on their meeting with Steve Sullivan they understand that the plans call for the turf to be developed this fall with the playground being scheduled for next fall. Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission Minutes of September 1, 1988 Meeting Page 4 Member Dick Carroll wanted! to clarify for the residents the reasoning behind this particular time frame. He noted that the turf needs to be established before any of the-long term park amenities 'can-be installed. The Commission takes a long hard look at the demographics each year in determining priorities for park development and the Commission appreciates the understanding of residents in accepting the timing of park development. Member Alt stated she was pleased to see such interest in a neighborhood park. She noted that the Commission has not in the past looked at the option of installing a wading pool and asked if Staff could research this possibility. Director Vraa stated that Staff would pursue this option and report back to the Commission. Members of the Commission expressed their concern about considering an amenity of this type in a neighborhood park rather than a community park. The concern was based on the number of people that would want to use an amenity like a wading pool resulting in more traffic than a neighborhood park is designed to handle. Mr. Ford asked about tennis courts since there was a strong interest shown by the residents. Director Vraa stated that the nearest courts would be at Northview Park after they are completed. He further stated that there are existing established thresholds for facilities based on a per thousand capita (one court per 1750 people). Currently the city is close to the threshold on tennis courts but with the completion of Northview we should be over the per thousand capita requirement. There will be a joint use agreement for the use of the courts with School District 196, however this should not greatly impede the use of-the-courts by the public. Understanding the importance of playground equipment in this neighborhood park, Director Vraa indicated that the residents shouldn't be expecting this to be installed until closer to fall, 1989. He felt that the possibility of having an open skate area for this winter was good. The skating area could. be placed in-such a way so as to utilize the parking lot lights for security. Chairman Carroll congratulated the residents for their interest and thanked them for their-. _i.nput. . The Commission and_ City Council. continues to try' t'o- give the'-best ^:facil-ities as fast as they can and the, support and understanding of the community is crucial. Director Vraa noted for the record that a skating area will. be installed at Bridle Ridge Park this winter and if residents want more specific information regarding the timing of playground equipment, that information will be made available in the spring of 1989 after park schedules are completed. Advisory Parks and Recreaion Commission Minutes of September 1,1988 Meeting Page 5 NORTHVIEW PARK NEIGHBORHOOD PETITION Director Vraa explained that a petition was received on Friday afternoon, August 26, 1988 from the neighborhood surrounding Northview Park requesting that the planned lighted softball fields not be allowed to be constructed. Mr. Vraa had had a conversation with Mark Schuldt who would be representing the interests of the signers of the petition. Mark Schuldt addressed the Commission and stated that he lives directly across Northview Park Road from the proposed lighted ball fields. He stated that the petitioners want to see how they can change the plans since the people he's talked to have indicated they don't want the fields; specifically the lights being planned for the fields. He further stated that the sign doesn't say "Lighted Ball Fields", it only says "Athletic Field" and his real estate agent told him it would be a park. Chairman Carroll noted that when someone is ready to purchase a homesite the best source of information for any development plans surrounding a given area would be the City. The plans were always there, from the time the land was purchased, to develop lighted softball fields. There was a great deal of time and money spent in researching sites that would be conducive to an athletic facility. Flat level land is necessary for athletic fields and this type of land is at a premium. Some of the only other options would be to purchase commercial/industrial land which is cost prohibitive for this purpose. Mark Schuldt stated that the petitioners concern is not for the existing fields; they want to know how they can stop the proposed expansion of lighted softball fields. One suggestion he offered was to combine fields on school property in conjunction with S.D. 196 so that the athletic facilities would not come so close to residential areas. As history, Director Vraa noted that there were a total of 20 sites that were available to look at for possible athletic sites. May, 1986 was the first time the Northview site was looked at for expansion purposes. In July, 1986 the Council approved the acquisition of this parcel with the closing occurring in October, 1986. When the 3 softball fields were planned the adjacent property was zoned R-4 and later downzoned to residential. The developers of this property directly west of the expansion property were aware of the planned lighted baseball fields at the time they decided to develop the residential lots. Lexington Square Addition came to the city for the first time in 1984. The plats first came in for the 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th Addition after the expansion property was considered for athletic facilities. The sign designating this property as an athletic complex with lighted fields has been in place for some time. In answer to the question of sharing school field space, a drawing of the planned fields was shown to the audience noting the school district has facilities packed as tightly as possible in the space available and they, too, are short of fields for their planned uses. The City and School District have entered into joint use agreements so as to use/share facilities as much as possible. Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission Minutes of September 1, 1988 Meeting Page 6 Mr. Schuldt asked why there were no facilities for neighborhood families. Mr. Vraa stated there are none at the present time but they are being planned for this area. 9 to 12 tennis courts will be going into the Northview Park, playground equipment will be installed in the park area as well as a trail. extension and picnic area. Some other possibilities being considered are horseshoe pits and perhaps a volleyball court. A skating rink will not be located in this park. Another resident asked if it was possible to move the proposed softball fields closer to the existing softball fields or put something else in it's place feeling that there were enough fields already. Director Vraa explained that the City has already spent in excess of $125,000 in grading the site and the intention is to continue the development of this parcel as athletic fields as was originally planned. The City is looking for additional sites for athletic facilities because the growth of the city dictates the need for expansion in this area. In response to a question regarding the timing for development of this site, Mr. Vraa stated that the fencing would be installed in the spring/summer of 1989 with the lighting being proposed for 1991-1992 depending upon the need. Another resident asked if the city would be looking at some new technology regarding the lighting of the field so as to have the least impact on the adjacent neighborhood. Director Vraa assured the residents that the city would be looking at all possibilities and the most current technology in lighting would be considered providing it is not cost prohibitive. The traffic was another concern to the neighborhood; specifically the impact the athletic field has on the constant flow of traffic. Again, Mr. Vraa explained that Northview Road was built to a community feeder road standard in anticipation of the traffic that would be generated by an athletic facility. Mr. Schuldt stated that he had moved into his home in December, 1987 and although there was a sign denoting an athletic field site there was no indication on the sign that there would be lighted fields until approximately two weeks ago. Parks Superintendent John VonDeLinde noted for the record that the existing sign with the words "lighted fields" was placed before the park was graded in 1987. Chairman Carroll thanked the residents for their interest and assured them that the Commission was sensitive to their concerns. There will be facilities installed in the future for small children in Northview Park and the residents can also use Patrick Eagan Park just across Lexington Avenue for family activities. Member Masin stated that the Commission could use any help it can get in acquiring property for athletic sites and thanked the residents for sharing their concerns with the Commission. Advisory Park and Recreation Commission Minutes of September 1, 1988 Page 7 SKATEBOARDERS PETITION Eight skateboarders addressed the Commission with their request and a petition to support a skateboard park in their neighborhood. There are 43 names on the petition indicating a genuine interest in this type of facility. Tim Brummer stated that they cannot put ramps on the streets and the space available for them to use their skateboards was very limited. They brought copies of some ramps they would be interested in seeing constructed in a park of this type. Larry Frank spoke on behalf of the skateboarders noting that he had constructed a small ramp/half-pipe in his back yard for his son and friends to use. He stated he has an appreciation for the athletic abilities of skateboarders and is concerned that there really isn't a place for them to expand their skills. They are all aware of the liability issues but noted that there were a number of successful skateboard parks in various parts of the country that are currently operating. After much discussion regarding the research that had been done to date on the skateboard liability issue Director Vraa suggested that perhaps a special event for skateboarders could be considered during the summer months. This would give the Commission a feel for the number of people that would like to participate in this sport. JoAnne Alt asked if Staff would look at this option as a special event during the summer. Bob Porter suggested that the 4th of July may be a good time to do this. ATHLETIC LIGHTING Craig Gallop of Musco Lighting was present to update the Commission on some of the newest technology in athletic lighting. He indicated the major concern regarding athletic lighting was the light spillage onto adjacent homeowners property. Until recently the only way to reduce the light spillage was by use of louvers however this also resulted in the loss of light on the field. Mr. Gallop also differentiated between spill light, the light that is measurable from adjacent property and glare light, the light you see when you look at a fixture. In the last six years there has been a great deal of research done to try to control the amount of spillage. Their theory is that the spill light comes from the lower 1/4 of the fixture whereas the field light comes from the top 3/4 of the fixture. They feel that by redirecting the lower 1/4 to the top 3/4 of the fixture it will then be directed down onto the field. Mr. Gallop then showed a video to substantiate this theory. Member Masin asked if this type of lighting is currently being used to test out the theory. One of the systems has been installed in Rochester and another is being planned for Minnetonka where homes are within 600 feet of the fields. The question of extra cost was addressed by stating that installation on a new field would cost approximately 5-7% over sportscluster lighting; Sportscluster 2 would be 5-6% more whereas Level 8 would be 6-8% more. Member Carroll noted that it was important to look into this lighting option and that Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission Minutes of September 1, 1988 Meeting Page 8 perhaps a test site would be a start. Director Vraa indicated that time would be spent looking into this lighting option and current installation would be monitored for effectiveness. MCCARTHY HOUSE Director Vraa noted for the Commission that per the memo on this item, it had been determined, after inspection, that this house had no historical value. The house had been used in the past as storage for the Eagan Athletic Association but it has since been emptied. Staff has researched the cost for demolition which has been estimated at $3400 - $4700. Additionally the well will have to be capped. Member Masin questioned if Dakota County or the Minnesota Historical Society had been contacted to inspect this property in the event it had historical value. After further discussion, Sandy Masin moved that if after checking with Dakota County and Minnesota Historical Society there is no historical value to the home that the building be demolished. The motion was seconded by Dick Carroll with all members voting in favor. DAKOTA COUNTY SOIL AND WATER CONSERVATION Director Vraa explained that the information provided on this issue was the preliminary report and the classification of ponds in the Eagan parks. John Barton notes in his letter that there will be a public hearing on these water bodies. Noting the magnitude of the information it was suggested that a work session be scheduled to review it. A date has not been set for the public hearing as yet but it was suggested that the work session take place before the public hearing so the Commission could have some input. Wayne Sames noted that there had been three meetings and that this was just-a partial list of the pond classifications. He asked if the Commission could get a map showing all the ponds and their classifications. Mr. Vraa noted that a storm sewer map would be prepared for the next Commission meeting. TRUST FUND Director Vraa explained that John. VonD.eLinde. had prepared a.. position paper and tried to broaden the range of possibilities in the use of this fund. Mr. VonDeLinde noted that the report addressed various issues including funding, the need for long range planning and the prioritization of management. The report explores a wide range of alternatives at this point and the Commission needs to direct Staff on how they should proceed. Member Masin stated this was a tremendous idea but felt the Commission needed more time to cover the many issues addressed in the position paper. Dick Carroll commented on what an excellent job staff had done in putting this together but concurred this item would take much more review and discussion. along with:a great deal of cooperation with:the City Council in making this work. One Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission Minutes of September 1, 1988 Meeting Page 9 priority would be to make sure dollars were expended each year so that the public would see that the money was being used for the purposes intended. Wayne Sames recommended setting up a subcommittee after the Commission has had an opportunity to review the position paper further. After further discussion the item was tabled and would be reviewed further at a work session. RAHN ROAD TRAIL Director Vraa reminded the Commission that a request had been made to install the trail link on Rahn Road south of Diffley to the Highline Trail now that work was progressing with the realignment of Rahn Road. After further discussion, Sandy Masin moved, Dick Carroll seconded with all members voting in favor to recommend the installation of a bituminous trail on Rahn Road south of Diffley to the Highline Trail. PARKS DEVELOPMENT An update of pending parks development shows that Thomas Lake shelter building is still awaiting laminated beams in order to continue with the construction. Slater Acres park has been rough graded and the rock has been laid for the trailways. Ohmann Park is currently undergoing bulk grading and the preliminary indication is that there will be sufficient topsoil to complete the park. TURF RESEEDING With the extensive damage done to the turf following the drought this summer, John VonDeLinde outlined for the Commission the procedure that would be followed to try to re-establish turf. Aeration would be the first step, followed by seeding, fertilization and broadleaf herbicide. Central Landscaping will be doing the shallow disking and seeding but one full year.of turf establishment has been lost. The greening up of the parks after the last rains is due to the crab grass that has grown. The new seed would not be able to compete with the crab grass thus it will be destroyed with Round-up and then seeding can begin. NORTHVIEW PARK - TENNIS COURTS Steve Sullivan reviewed for the Commission the site at Northview Park just south of Field 5 near the pond where the proposed tennis courts will be installed. It is possible to get 12 tennis courts in this site but it may be cost- prohibitive because of, the amount of grading necessary to make that configuration work. Mr. Sullivan reviewed Diagram A which shows 11 staggered courts similar to the configuration of Blue Cross/Blue Shield courts. The playground area would go directly adjacent to the tennis courts, pond and picnic area. This plan is more a "pod" concept rather than "bank" style courts with two pods containing 4 courts and one pod containing 3 courts. Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission Minutes of September 1, 1988 Meeting Page 10 Diagram B showed 10 courts in a "bank" configuration with the picnic area to the north of the courts. Diagram C again shows a "pod" design for 10 courts; one pod of 4 courts and two pods of_3.courts. The stagger in this configuration allows the use of the existing grade or with less grading than the other layouts require. The playground would stay in the same area as Diagram A. Mr. Sullivan noted that he felt Diagram C was the most cost effective option at this point based on these preliminary drawings. In reference to the cost for lighting and fencing, it would be more cost efficient to do a bank of courts rather than the staggered layout but all other factors should remain the same. The school district will be making the final determination on the number of courts to be installed based on the cost estimates. Mr. Vraa noted that in their considering more than 10 courts they may have to look at extensive grading and development costs because of the topography of the land. The consensus of the Commission was that the "pod" configuration was more aesthetically pleasing and would tie into the existing topography better. Mr. Sullivan noted that there was further work necessary on the plan and he will proceed with the plans based on the Commission recommendations and comments. COMMUNITY CENTER Director Vraa reminded the Commission members that the next scheduled design charette for the community center would be September 21, 22 and 23. An agenda would be provided as soon as it became available. HAPPENINGS Director Vraa mentioned that the City of Burnsville would be hosting the 1989 Summer Star of the North Games and they have approached the communities of Eagan, Apple Valley and Lakeville for field space during the event. Mr. Vraa wanted to alert the Commission to the possible request from Burnsville for Eagan facilities. There is some concern, however, regarding stopping the use of Eagan's planned field use for this period of time. Sandy Masin asked how Burnsville could have been awarded this bid without first having been able to provide the facilities needed. COMMISSION PICNIC The date of Friday, September 23, 1988 was set for the annual Commission picnic at Trapp Farm Park. The invitations will be sent out shortly and a committee will be set up to handle the food. Volunteers will be needed to man the grill! Advisory Parks and Recreation Commission Minutes of September 1, 1988 Meeting Page 11 OCTOBER AGENDA Just as a reminder, Director Vraa advised the Commission that the Parks Dedication Review and 1989 Parks Project Review will be handled at the October Commission meeting. Chairman Carroll stated the Commission was pleased to see that Dorothy Peterson was back in action again after her recent surgery. With no further business to conduct, Sandy Masin moved, JoAnne Alt seconded with all members voting in favor to adjourn. The meeting was adjourned at 11:10 P.M. DATE SECRETARY