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12/03/1992 - Advisory Parks & Recreation Commission MINUTES OF REGULAR MEETING OF ADVISORY PARKS, RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION EAGAN, MINNESOTA DECEMBER 3, 1992 A regular meeting of the Advisory Parks, Recreation and Natural Resources Commission was called to order at 7:00 p.m. on Thursday, December 3, 1992 by Vice Chair Ted Billy. The following Commission Members were present: Ted Billy, Deborah Johnson, Lee Markell, Dan Mooradian, Kevin Knight, Erin Ipsen- Borgersen and Jack Johnson. Commission Member Jonathan Widem was not present. Staff present included Ken Vraa, Director of Parks and Recreation, Stephen Sullivan, Landscape Architect/Park Planner; Dorothy Peterson, Superintendent of Recreation; Rich Brasch, Water Quality Coordinator; )on Oyanagi, Recreation Supervisor and Cherryl Mesko, Secretary. AGENDA Kevin Knight moved, Dan Mooradian seconded with all members voting in favor to accept the agenda as presented. MINUTES OF REGULAR MEETING OF NOVEMBER 5, 1992 Ted Billy moved, Lee Markell seconded with all members voting in favor to accept the minutes of November 5, 1992 as presented. CONSENT AGENDA After review of the park and trail dedication issues by Park Planner Stephen Sullivan and review of the water quality issues by Water Resources Coordinator Rich Brasch, Dan Mooradian moved, Erin Ipsen-Borgersen seconded the motion to make the following recommendations to the City Council. All members voted in favor. 1. Braun Sunrise 2nd Addition-Henry A. Braun. Lots 2 and 3, Block 1, Braun Sunrise 2nd Addition be subject to a cash parkland dedication and cash trailways dedication. Water quality treatment requirements would be met through the payment of cash dedication in lieu of on-site ponding and there are no wetlands subject to jurisdiction under the Wetlands Conservation Act on the site. 2. Park Center 3rd Addition - Taco Bell Corporation. The proposal is subject to a cash parks dedication. The proposal is also subject to the costs of the bituminous trail along Cliff Road based on the lot frontage at the City's current trail rate. The cost shall be 254' frontage feet at $12.05 per foot obligating the applicant to a total trails cost of $3060.70. This amount shall be paid at the time of building permit application. The water quality treatment requirements for the entire Park Center Plan Development have been met with the construction of Pond AP-50, therefore neither additional ponding requirements nor cash dedications are recommended. ADVISORY PARKS, RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION Minutes of December 3, 1992 Meeting Page 2 PARK NAMING Director Vraa indicated that he had talked with Dick Carroll and although Mr. Carroll has completed the research into the history of the parks that are to be named, he was unable to meet with the Commission prior to their meeting. It was decided that another meeting would be set at a later date to address this issue. PARKS/TRAILS DEDICATION REVIEW Director Vraa introduced this item as being carried over from the November Commission meeting. At that meeting the Commission determined it would like additional information pertaining to land values. Based on that request staff identified several vacant parcels within the community and researched them as to their market value as determined by the Dakota County Assessor's Department. Ken added that the parcels are zoned agricultural or as part of a PUD that has an underlying zoning of agriculture, however, it was noted that it would be unlikely that the landowner would sell the property for the assessed value indicated. Because of that, Ken suggested that the Commission look at the land values with some caution since the price per acre was anywhere between $367 - $23,560 per acre. Ted Billy, noting that there had been a lengthy discussion at the last meeting with a split vote to freeze the 1993 fees at the 1992 rates, suggested that since there was no concrete data substantiating a proposed increase that the rates for 1993 remain the same as 1992. Jack Johnson and Kevin Knight concurred with Mr. Billy's comments but Mr. Knight added that the recommendation to the City Council should strongly emphasize the importance of hiring an appraiser to look at land values for the 1994 rates. After further discussion, Ted Billy moved, Dan Mooradian seconded with all members voting in favor to have the parks and trails dedications fees for 1993 remain the same as they had been for 1992. Further that an appraiser be hired to review land values for evaluation of the 1994 parks and trails dedication fees. Kevin Knight thanked staff for providing the best information available to the Commission to help with this decision. He continued that once an appraiser has done some research it would be easier to determine a fair but equitable land value to base the 1994 fees. MINNESOTA VALLEY TRAIL RESOLUTION Superintendent of Recreation Peterson introduced this item as a proposed resolution supporting expansion of funding by the state and Department of Natural Resources for arterial connection acquisition and construction of the Minnesota Valley Trail. Dorothy reminded the Commission that the Department had submitted a grant application to the Metropolitan Council seeking funds under the Federal Internodal Transportation Efficiency Act (ISTEA) for federal funding of various trail development projects in Eagan. Identified as the highest priority in the City's grant was the Fort Snelling State Park Trail Access from Rahn Road,Beau-d-Rue Drive, and Silver Bell to Nichols Road. Dorothy continued that Eagan was the only south of the river city represented at a recent workshop with representatives from the Minneapolis Park Board, Minnesota Department of Natural Resources, MnDOT, Dakota County, MAC, and the Metropolitan Council. Jack Johnson expressed his support for the resolution noting the positive impact this will have in connecting Eagan with other communities. ADVISORY PARKS, RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION Minutes of December 3, 1992 Meeting Page 3 After further discussion Kevin Knight moved, Lee Markell seconded with all members voting in favor to recommend the acceptance of the Resolution urging the expansion of funding for acquisition and construction of the Minnesota Valley Trail and arterial connections. SOFTBALL ELIGIBILITY CHANGE Director Vraa introduced this item as a review of the adult softball eligibility requirements based on recommendations made by the League Leadership Committee and then introduced Recreation Supervisor Jon Oyanagi who provided the Commission with further background. Jon noted that the League Leadership Committee is comprised of representatives from teams in the variety of men's, women's and co-recreational leagues. Although the City maintains final authority in matters regarding facilities, league offerings and policies, the committee gets involved in league rule evaluation and changes. Jon continued that after the 1991 season the League Leadership Committee recommended the expansion of "outside" players from three to five per team with a fee of $25.00 being imposed for the fourth and fifth players. This item was brought to the Commission in November, 1991 and they recommended that the "outside" player number remain at three and that those three players be assessed an outside player fee of $25.00. With the completion of the 1992 softball season the impact of the new fee has been evaluated. Jon noted that the men's teams increased by one team compared to 1991, the women's teams decreased by two teams from 1991 and co-recreational grew by 13 teams compared to 1991. Based on the numbers of teams participating in 1992 and the concern for participation numbers dropping due to the strict eligibility requirements, Jon continued that the League Leadership has made two recommendations for the Commission to consider for the 1993 softball season. The first recommendation is to drop the $25.00 outside player fee for the women's program as well as expand the eligality boundaries to include Mendota Heights, Apple Valley and Rosemount (cities without women's leagues) in order to re-build the women's program. The second recommendation was to grandfather former Eagan players if they have played in Eagan as a local player for at least 5 consecutive years with the same team. These teams would require that the grandfathered players would still be responsible for the $25.00 "outside" player fee but would not be counted as one of the three allowed "outside" players. Additionally, if a player skips a year or changes teams, they are no longer grandfathered. Jon noted that the rationale for the second recommendation was to accommodate players who have played on an Eagan team for several years, move to another suburb, but want to continue playing with their" team. Mr. Oyanagi indicated that administering the grandfathering option could be very difficult but possible. It would require several hours of data entry to get the information on all team members. Kevin Knight asked what advantages there would be to having all the information necessary to monitor the grandfathering option. Jon indicated that it could also serve as a valuable data base for other information the department may want to retrieve, however, the updating each year would require a big block of time. Jack Johnson asked if by encouraging an increase in the number of teams will the existing facilities be strained. Jon responded that currently there are some openings in Monday and Friday which allows for potential growth. Mr. Johnson responded that if the existing number of teams are maintained there would appear to be very limited potential for growth and by encouraging more outside players he opined that growth would appear to be limited for Eagan residents. ADVISORY PARKS, RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION Minutes of December 3,1992 Page 4 John Ruppert, manager of one of the women's softball teams, indicated that the impact of the outside player fees has resulted in a drop in the women's program. He continued that teams can pull additional players from the 'draft list" (available players not affiliated with a particular team) but a large number of those players are from surrounding communities that do not have a women's program. With the allowance of three outside players it is often difficult for managers to field a full team and remain eligible. John continued that by allowing for the flexibility to include surrounding communities within the eligibility limitations it would help to increase the number of women's teams that may participate. Dan Mooradian asked if the dropping of the outside player fee or opening boundaries for the women's program would have the most benefit. Jon Oyanagi responded that initiating both options would be beneficial. Jon continued that communities such as Apple Valley and Burnsville allow up to 49% outside player participation and the fee is similar to what Eagan charges. Mr. Mooradian asked if there would be a problem with the men's teams if it was decided to waive the women's outside player fees and extend the eligibility boundaries. Mr. Ruppert responded that the League Leadership representatives for the men's teams appeared to understand the rationale for instituting this type of change in order to re-build the women's program. In response to a question regarding the amount of time necessary to implement a program to monitor the grandfathering of players, Mr. Oyanagi responded that it is estimated that 40-60 hours would be required to put the preliminary information into a data base. Ted Billy asked staff what their recommendations were regarding this item. Mr. Oyanagi responded that staff would like to see the fee dropped for the women's program as well as expanding the boundaries but they are looking for direction from the Commission regarding the grandfathering option. Jack Johnson indicated he was in favor of grandfathering players and charging a $25 outside player fee for those participating in the men's program and he also favored dropping the $25.00 outside player fee for the women's teams along with expanding the boundaries. Kevin Knight agreed with the changes proposed in the women's program but felt that the grandfathering option for the men's teams would require too much time to setup and monitor. Ted Billy suggested as an option to grandfathering that the number of outside players be changed to 4 or 5; this would generate almost as much money as grandfathering while eliminating the time involved in administering such a program. Mr. Johnson reiterated his support for grandfathering players into the men's leagues based on the recommendations made by the League Leadership Committee. After further discussion Erin lpsen-Borgersen moved, Lee Markell seconded with all members voting in favor to drop the $25.00 outside player fee for the women's softball program and to expand the eligibility boundaries to include Mendota Heights, Apple Valley and Rosemount. Ted Billy moved, Erin Ipsen-Borgersen seconded a motion to charge a fee of $25.00for each 'outside player" rostered and to increase the number of outside players allowed per team from 3 to 5. Those voting in favor included Ted Billy, Deborah Johnson, Lee Markell, Dan Mooradian,Kevin Knight, and Erin Ipsen- Borgersen. Jack Johnson opposed the motion. The motion was carried. ST. THOMAS BECKET CHURCH - TRAILS DEDICATION REVIEW Director Vraa introduced this item as a request fortrails dedication credit by St. Thomas Becket church. At the time of the preliminary plat, the Commission recommended that parks dedication fees associated with the project be deferred until such time as the church should ever change land use and that the plat be subject to a cash trails dedication. The church is now requesting credit be applied to the trails dedication amount for on-site trail development. Mr. Vraa continued that in a meeting with St. Thomas Beckett ADVISORY PARKS, RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION Minutes of December 3, 1992 Meeting Page 5 representatives regarding the reduction in trail dedication fees it was noted that an outlot will be created on property east of Highway 3 and by definition outlots are not subject to a trail dedication at this time. Based on the change in the area, Mr. Vraa estimated that the actual area being used for the church proper is approximately 17 acres with a trails dedication amount of approximately $14,500. Director Vraa continued that the church is requesting trails dedication based on their perception that although the internal trails they are proposing to build are not part of the city's comprehensive trails plan, they do provide an amenity to the city and could eventually connect to the city's trail system. The trail being proposed is approximately 1400 feet long, five feet wide and internal to the site. As a point of reference, Mr. Vraa noted that staff usually estimates trails construction cost at $12.00-$13.00 per lineal foot for 8 foot wide trails. Mr. Vraa concluded that historically the Advisory Commission has not wavered from its trails dedication requirements. Mr. Craig Rafferty, representative for St. Thomas Becket Church, addressed the Commission noting that Mr. Vraa had covered the background very well and reiterated their desire for trails dedication credit for the internal trails that will be provided on this site. As a point of clarification Lee Markell asked if the trail width is 5 feet or 8 feet. Mr. Rafferty responded that his understanding was that the width was 5 feet, however they are open to installing an 8 foot wide trail. He continued that at one point the trail will connect with a five foot sidewalk which would require the narrowing of the 8 foot trail into the 5 foot sidewalk. Commission Member Markell, noting that he is a member of St.Thomas Becket Church and has been serving on the committee for the site development of the church, indicated he would abstain from voting on this issue. Steve Sullivan indicated that staff has reviewed the proposed trail trying to determine whether it can be tied in to existing trails and what community benefit would be derived from it's installation. Ted Billy noted that it appears that the trail dead ends on both the east and the west and asked if the trail could tie into Lakeside Park on the west. Mr. Sullivan responded that the comprehensive trail plan does not cover a trail from Lakeside Park to the east through this property. Mr. Rafferty explained that the residents to the north would benefit by this trail by having a safer access to Lakeside Park and also cited the potential for residential development to the south of the site which could also tie into Lakeside Park through the church property. Lee Markell reiterated that the trail would provide good access to Lakeside Park to those residents off Tofte Lane but suggested that the trail be 8 feet wide. Mr. Rafferty continued that the church's request is to use the proposed trail dedication fee to provide for the proposed internal trails on this site, again citing the access to Lakeside Park as the rationale for providing such a credit. Jack Johnson asked if the proponent was requesting help with construction of the trail to which Mr. Rafferty responded no. Mr. Rafferty again reiterated that the church felt the cost of the internal trails they are proposing would be approximately the cost of the trail dedication fee requested. Mr. Johnson noted that park dedication credit has been provided in the past when the developer proposed an amenity that would benefit the community and expressed his support for some type of credit. Deborah Johnson asked how the Commission has determined the value of a credit in the past. Mr. Vraa responded that in the past parks dedication credit up to 25% has been issued based on the benefit the amenity would provide to the community. Mr. Vraa continued that the trails dedication policy does not currently provide for credits, however the Commission may make that determination if they deem it appropriate. As a point of clarification Mr. Vraa explained that in the past the types of credits that have been issued have been within single/multiple family residential areas and have included items such as tennis courts which would help alleviate the demand on existing park amenities. ADVISORY PARKS, RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION Minutes of December 3,1992 Meeting Page 6 Lee Markel) added that the trail from Tofte Lane to Atlantic Hills Drive is a valuable link for those residents from the north to Lakeside Park and should be considered as such in the Commission's decision. Deborah Johnson expressed her concern as to whether the Commission was looking at the big picture on this issue. Ted Billy asked if a trail was going to be constructed by the City, would this be the location for a trail link to tie in the existing trail system. As a point of clarification, Steve Sullivan indicated that the trails dedication policy looked at the undeveloped land remaining in the city, the need for transporting residents in the safest and most efficient manner via a trail system and then calculated how much it would cost to complete that system. The total cost is then divided by the zoning designation of the undeveloped land to cover those costs. Based on the comprehensive trails system, Steve noted that this proposed trail would not be a priority at the present time. Erin Ipsen added that the dollars set aside for trails dedication were to provide transportation and to tie into an existing trails system. Jack Johnson commented that this proposed trail could also provide access to the scenic areas on the southern portion of the site. He felt that access to the lake area would provide an amenity to the city. When asked what the actual trails dedication was for this site, Mr.Vraa responded that it was approximately $14,500. Dan Mooradian indicated he was in general agreement with Mr. Johnson's opinion for providing some type of credit but was unsure as to what that amount should be. Ted Billy noted that it appeared that the major purpose for the north/south internal trail was to tie the parking lots to the building. Mr. Rafferty explained that the extended trail is also serving as a convenience to pedestrians in the neighborhood. Lee Markell added that the City Planning Department wanted vehicular access to Tofte Lane which resulted in the trail link from Tofte Lane to Atlantic Hills Drive. Mr. Billy expressed his concern that a trails dedication credit was being requested for a trail constructed on private property. Mr. Rafferty indicated that the trails were intended to serve the neighborhood, north of St. Thomas Beckett church. He continued that there is an expense to provide this trail connection and the church is looking to offset the trails dedication fees. Dan Mooradian, recognizing the validity of the loop connecting the northern neighborhood to Lakeside Park asked if a portion of the trail could be separated, i.e. could the Commission provide a credit for the north loop but not for the balance of the trail. Mr. Rafferty indicated that access to the lakeshore on the southern portion of the property was seen as a valuable asset as well and the potential that exists to tie the proposed residential area to the south through St. Thomas Beckett's internal trails. Dan Mooradian reiterated the importance of connecting the northern neighborhood but questioned the importance of the southern trail link. Lee Markell commented that the view of the lake from the knoll is the best view and felt this would be an important amenity to people using the trail. Mr. Billy again reiterated his concern for having a trail on private property noting that access could be denied at any time therefore making the trail unusable except to the property owners. Deborah Johnson also expressed her concern for the liability of a city trail link on private property. Ted Billy moved to deny the request for trails dedication credit. There was no second to the motion and the motion died. Jack Johnson moved that recognizing the value of the trail as an amenity to the park system plan that a trails dedication credit of 80% of the approximate $14,500 trails dedication fee be provided based on a 1400 foot, 8 foot wide trail. There was no second to the motion and the motion died. Ken Vraa suggested that if the Commission was inclined to offer a trails dedication credit that they consider simply obtaining an easement from St. Thomas Becket, have the city construct the trail and not issue any credit at all. Mr. Markell indicated that the church would not be open to providing an easement for that purpose. ADVISORY PARKS, RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION Minutes of December 3, 1992 Meeting Page 7 Erin Ipsen-Borgersen moved that a 50% credit of the trails dedication fees be considered based on an 8 foot bituminous trail that connects the neighborhood to the north side of said property beginning on Tofte Lane and the west side of the property ending on Atlantic Hills Drive. Dan Mooradian seconded the motion. Kevin Knight amended the motion to state that the trails dedication credit be limited to the actual construction cost of the 8 foot bituminous trail based on $12/foot. Kevin Knight amended the motion to state that the actual per foot cost of trails construction is to be determined by the contractor. Erin Ipsen-Borgersen accepted the amendments to her motion. Those voting in favor were Deborah Johnson, Dan Mooradian, Kevin Knight, Jack Johnson and Erin Ipsen. Ted Billy was opposed and Lee Markell abstained. PARKS UPDATE Parks Planner Sullivan explained that because of the weather the curb and gutter was not completed this year. He added that the muck excavation for pond BP-2 would begin following the draining of that pond. Steve continued that approximately 47% of the contract has been completed to date and Pay Request #2 for $127,000 will be submitted to the City Council for payment. Steve continued that 4 park concepts are being worked on for PSA 36E as well as acquisition possibilities. Additionally, concept layout plans are being worked on for the Lexington/Diffley site. PROPOSED RULES OVERVIEW/WETLANDS CONSERVATION ACT Water Resources Coordinator Rich Brasch noted that the Minnesota Board of Soil and Water Resources published the proposed permanent rules for the 1991 Wetlands Conservation Act on October 19, 1992. The comment period of the proposed rules will extend through December 22 and the rules may or may not be revised based on public comment but will become effective no later than July 1, 1993. Rich noted that all 6 issues listed in the briefing document reflect the common ground of the local government units and developers/land users that presented the information. He continued that the sequencing requirements apply to all wetlands and this, combined with other requirements, may require a great deal of monitoring. Rich noted that the objection process allows for anyone to object for any reason and there is concern that this will slow down the process. The groups providing input into this process are suggesting that guidelines be placed on the objections. Rich continued that the preliminary rules are reflective of a 44 member group. STATUS OF WETLAND MAPPING/CLASSIFICATION Mr. Brasch reminded the Commission that the purpose of the wetland inventory was to help the efforts in administering the Wetlands Conservation Act as well as examine whether to pursue additional wetlands management and protection initiatives. Rich continued that RFPs were sent out to seven firms with six firms responding. Frank Svoboda and Associates was selected to conduct the work. It was noted that Mr. Svoboda has done similar work for the City of Chanhassen and several other local units of government. A joint project is being pursued between the City of Eagan and Dakota County to develop a geographic information system for Eagan which would include information on the location of wetlands in the city. The role of the consultant includes identifying type of wetlands using both classification systems, identifying the degree of degradation and restorable wetlands in priority areas and possibly locating stormwater ponds that may have assumed wetland characteristics. It is anticipated that the work will be completed by March 30, 1993. ADVISORY PARKS, RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION Minutes of December 3, 1992 Meeting Page 8 RE-CLASSIFICATION OF POND LP-47 Mr. Brasch reminded the Commission that in August, 1992 they reviewed water quality and wetlands impact issues associated with the St. Thomas Becket church development. Staff recommended that an existing pond in the southeast corner of the site be enlarged to receive and treat stormwater runoff from the site to provide maximum protection to Hay Lake. Discharge to LP-47 was considered desirable by staff to further remove pollutants before the waster was introduced to Hay Lake which was consistent with the water quality plan classification of LP-47 as a nutrient basin. In order to make possible gravity drainage from LP-47 to Hay Lake, the normal water level in both ponds needs to be raised. In addition, creation of a two-cell pond as part of the St. Thomas Becket church development would decrease pollutant loading to Hay Lake to near acceptable levels. Rich continued that if the Commission would like to consider this proposal, staff would assemble a brief feasibility analysis that examines issues which need to be considered in making the decision and develop a recommendation for possible re-classification of the wetland. DEPARTMENT HAPPENINGS Some of the items covered by Superintendent of Recreation Peterson included the first meeting of the Eagan Seniors at Eagan Woods; distribution of the winter "Discover Us!" is scheduled for December 9th with registration to be held on December 12th,; a meeting between Parks and Recreation and Eagan Hockey will occur regarding expectations of services; the outdoor speaker system has been installed at Clearwater Park; interviews are nearing completion for Winter Recreation Leaders; the North Pole calling program is scheduled for December 9 and 10; maintenance equipment to winter operations has been completed; and winter skating facilities were inspected and repaired in preparation for the winter activities. COMMUNITY ORIENTED POLICING Superintendent of Recreation Peterson introduced this item indicating that staff has been attending COP meetings for several months. The purpose of the committee meetings has been to foster an understanding of the concept of community oriented policing (COP) and to identify how best to implement the philosophy in the City of Eagan. Dorothy continued that police sergeants have been assigned to each beat and are currently forming advisory groups for that beat area. It was noted that Parks and Recreation's role in Community Oriented Policing is only generally defined at this time. In addition to administrative issues such as who requests programs,from whom and how, other basic issues identified include what can Parks and Recreation actually do; what is the relationship between Parks and Recreation and Community Oriented Policing and are there specific examples of what Parks and Recreation can do. Dorothy explained that one of the major concerns was based on budget since no dollars have been earmarked for COP at this point. Dorothy continued that Brooklyn Park started this program with a grant and this is an option the City may want to consider as well. There has also been some concern expressed that this could result in new programming options which would require special staffing needs. Jack Johnson concurred with the concern expressed regarding funding possible new programs. He agreed that it would be a good program if there was a way in which to offset some of the costs involved. Kevin Knight also agreed with concern for funding but hoped that the department would remain active and participate in this program. ADVISORY PARKS, RECREATION AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMISSION Minutes of December 3, 1992 Meeting Page 9 With no further business to conduct, Lee Markel) moved, Deborah Johnson seconded with all members voting in favor to adjourn the meeting. The meeting was adjourned at 9:50 p.m. Xo Secre ry Date